DETROIT POLICE CHIEF JAMES CRAIG ON BLM, ANTIFA, CRIME AND MORE.
/EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW WITH DETROIT POLICE CHIEF JAMES CRAIG
Cops Count, Leadership Matters
By Daniel Del Valle, Shai Carr and Catherine Angel
Police Chief James Craig has an impressive law enforcement career that began in 1977 as a Detroit police officer. In 1981 he became a Los Angeles police officer and worked his way up the ranks in our profession, serving as the police chief in Portland, Maine, and Cincinnati, Ohio, before returning to his roots at the Detroit Police Department where he currently serves as chief of police.
Recently, Chief Craig has been making national headlines as a no-nonsense law enforcement leader who stands up for his officers, and serves and protects the community with integrity and pride. Chief Craig is a role model for many big city law enforcement leaders. We at Blue Magazine believe many law enforcement leaders can learn valuable lessons from emulating Chief Craig.
Blue Magazine recently traveled to Detroit to sit down with Chief Craig and discuss many important issues effecting law enforcement. We thank Chief Craig and all the fine officers we met at the Detroit Police Department for their hospitality and professionalism. Be safe out there!
The Blue Magazine: Let's get right into it. Attorney General Barr recently came to Detroit. He toured your city and promised to help you combat crime. How was this offer received?
Chief James Craig: I was excited. This was a continuation of what we already started. Let's be candid. People manipulate the narrative. They're sending federal troops into the cities to do what? In some cities, the statements are made that they're here to manage peaceful protesters. That was never the case here in Detroit, never. Factually, this department has been in a relationship with federal law enforcement now for 26 years. 1994, to be exact.
In December, AG Barr visited our city under a new operation that was being launched then to assist select cities in reducing violence. And while the department had made some great strides to drive violence down, one of the things that was clear, per capita violence was still higher than it should be.
Then in December, I stood with AG Barr and all the heads of the federal law enforcement entities, FBI, ATF, U.S. Marshals, DEA, who came to Detroit. I remember AG Barr telling me then we like what we see, what's going on in terms of law enforcement. Innovative department, crime is coming down and we think we can be helpful and then your leadership, chief, and so I wanted to announce Relentless Pursuit here in Detroit and that's what he did. So, of course, after he left and they began to develop a strategy to assist the select cities, COVID hits and we know the impact COVID had. Then right after COVID, we transitioned quickly into the tragic killing of Mr. Floyd and in subsequent protests in major cities across this country, some of which were very violent. As a byproduct of this, the COVID, anti-police rhetoric, bail reform, just to name a few, a lot of our major cities, particularly those who saw tremendous reductions in violence, began to soar with crime. So the idea was that Operation Legend, which is what it is called now, is a continuation and enhancement, if you will, of Relentless Pursuit. And so that's what gets lost. I've talked about it nationally and locally, it's a continuation. Its enhancement and so clearly, the people of Detroit want effective and efficient law enforcement. They want to mitigate the violence that has occurred and they're very aware of the spike like in so many cities.
Is the spike in crime correlated with COVID and the Floyd incident?
Absolutely, and I can certainly go into that. So let's reflect on what's driving violence now. Why now, you know, COVID and then protests and bail reform. So we all know with COVID, there's been a tremendous push in many of the large cities to do what? Early release of some violent, predatory criminals now. But we understand that there could have been more thought as to who gets released. I mean, if it's a property crime suspect, a habitual offender who is a burglar, OK, fine. But when you start letting individuals out who have a propensity to violence, what do you think is going to happen? That's what we're seeing in our major cities. Then let's talk briefly about bail reform. Does there need to be reform to our bail system? Certainly, but we're talking again same concept, violent predatory criminals historically engaging in violence. Is this someone you want to reintroduce back into our communities? So it's not a surprise when you see it. Then what we've also seen across this country is increased aggression of suspects against our men and women who wear the uniform, not just here in Detroit but across this country. And why is that? Because suspects today feel emboldened. They've embraced the anti-police rhetoric and in many of these cities, police officers are not supported. So it gives suspects this sense of I can do what I want.
Do you correlate a lot of this uproar, negativity and culture against law enforcement to the Democratic Party?
I'm not going to get into the politics of it. If I was in New York right now, I would probably have an answer for you. But here our mayor, who happens to be Democrat, is very supportive of law enforcement. OK? That's the difference.
You have a police chief and a mayor who are in sync on
reducing violence in this city.
I'm not the chief of police in New York or New Jersey or Portland or Seattle. You know, that doesn't mean that they’re individuals who serve in leadership, political leadership positions who have adopted this anti-police rhetoric like dismantle the police, defund the police. That's not a conversation being had by our mayor. It's not being had by the majority of our elected city council. There are few who have embraced the notion of defunding, but that's not the same. So again, as I've taken a stand that you cannot paint an entire party or all of these cities, some of which are run by Democrats, as not effective. Take it individually. Now, there are some cities… Frankly, what I see going on in my own home of Los Angeles is troubling. They've defunded the LAPD. The problem I find with this conversation, not your conversation, but with the conversation about the defunding and dismantling is a group of people who are speaking, they allege, are speaking for the people who live in that city. Well, I can tell you here in Detroit, these outsiders who've come into Detroit who have been protesting, they do not speak for Detroiters.
Detroiters don't want to defund the police. They don't want to dismantle this police department. And, of course, across the board, all of us in this business have denounced the tragic killing of Mr. Floyd in Minneapolis. But does that mean that every department across this country is in some way having problems? That's not the case here in Detroit. And so these outsiders have come into our city to hijack the message. It's a hijacking of the message. Then you have in some of these cities, people who sit in seats of leadership, who stand quiet because they lack the courage to stand up and take a position to support law enforcement, support their communities. Talking about safety and generally the people who claim to speak for people who live in these communities, they don't live in the cities. They don't live in the areas in many of our large urban centers that are populated by mostly persons of color. And when you talk to people who live in those communities, and I have whether it was L.A. and Cincinnati, I can tell you they want the police.
So let's discuss deeper how Detroit is different than other major cities. How did Detroit get to a point where, say, someone like AG Barr was recently received here without political interference?
It's shameful that we got to think in terms of partisan politics. It's shameful. This is about fighting crime. I can tell you that I didn't get a lot of pushback and there were some who expressed concern about operationalizing in Detroit. Once, the message was hijacked by this mob mentality that put out the narrative that the feds are coming into these cities to control and manage peaceful protesters. Now, it is factual that there were some federal buildings being attacked. I think it was in Portland they were protecting federal property. That was not the case here. In fact, we know definitively we have never asked for federal support to manage the now week 12 of protests. Not one time. We didn't ask for the National Guard. We didn't ask for outside assistance because we didn't need it. And we were very clear that we had a few days of disruptions. The first three days following the Floyd situation, there were some cars attacked, police officers attacked. But in comparison to some of these other cities, I'm sure you're aware of Los Angeles, Philadelphia, New York City, where there was burning, looting, riot and civil unrest. We didn't have that.
Why?
I'm glad you asked, because, frankly, as I've said to my colleagues in other cities, you cannot wait till something bad happens to then decide, well, I’ve got to work with the community. I had to get this relationship from day one when I got here. That's part, I guess, is part of my DNA. I understand the benefits of having a trust base, and I put emphasis on trust, trust-based relationships with people you're serving. That's very important. And it doesn't start when there's an officer-involved shooting incident. It's an everyday thing and it's institutionalized in this department.
I give a lot of credit to our community. I give a lot of credit to our police officers who rely heavily on their training, the execution and understanding to use only the force that is necessary. And so it's a combination of things. A false narrative was perpetrated where there was an allegation that we ran over peaceful protesters with one of our scout cars. False. What happened, several of the protesters became agitated, angry because the police officers were on scene wanting to redirect the path of the march and doing so, that core group of the angry mob surrounded our police vehicle. They began to attack the vehicle, got on the hood, started beating on the sides of the car and the officers you could see in the video that they were very carefully trying to move the police SUV, but it continued. And then at some point, one in the angry mob took out the back window of the scout car. And according to one officer, who was in it, he didn't know if he was being fired upon. So at that point, he had only one thing to do and to get out of there. Even then, he tried to do so in a very careful way because he knew there was a potential for some of these individual sustaining injuries. Yet the headlines and the story was these were peaceful protesters who were incited by Detroit Police Department. Conveniently left out was that some of these “peaceful protesters” were armed with long wooden-handle hammers. They left it out. So that's what we're dealing with, not just here in Detroit. Again, it's not the Detroiters that we're dealing with. We're dealing with the outside agitators; the domestic terrorists who have come into our city like they've come in to other major cities across this country.
But chiefs in your position are not saying anything. They're going along with it and we have to, at some point, understand that these chiefs are being controlled by their mayors. You obviously have a different type of approach. How are you handling that approach where others cannot?
Well, first of all, I'm sworn and obligated to protect. If a day comes where I cannot fulfill my obligation to this community and my obligation to the men and women who serve, then that should be my last day of working. It's just that simple. So, I'm going to make decisions. Our mayor respects my experience and my decision-making. I'm keenly aware that I would be held accountable for a bad decision. I'm not perfect, but I've been doing it long enough to know what's important. The day I stop supporting the good work of our officers is a day that we will see what we see in other cities, and that's called de-policing. We don't de-police here in Detroit. In fact, despite the necessity to manage these protests, now week 12, our police officers are still every week going out every day and making arrests for individuals who are illegally carrying guns.
That's because you have their back. Is that safe to say?
It's safe to say. And they know that they come up to me and they say, chief, we appreciate you. Whether you sit in my seat or you sit in some other seat, it does take courage. And the problem today is that there are individuals who lack the intestinal fortitude to stand up, despite what the vocal minority is saying. There are people who sit in elected seats who refuse to stand up, but they call me, I need your help. Because what I've come to understand and we saw evidence of this in other cities, whether it was Portland, Oregon, or Seattle, the mob turned on the mayors.
As you know, some police precincts around the country were overtaken by criminals. How far would you go to stop this siege if it happened in your city?
You use whatever force is necessary to overcome violence. I didn't say excess, not excessive force — the appropriate force that is necessary. Now, if the situation is you were overrun, outstaffed, I mean, there's something called officer safety, but that doesn't mean you go into a full retreat and abandon. So there's a strategy that should be in place. But one strategy, it's not retreat. For example, we had somebody wanted to set up a little mini no cop zone here in the city of Detroit. I got the call from one of my commanders on the ground. He said, we had the intel and they
just set it up. I tell you what, give them one morning. Not a lot of time, a few minutes and I want them gone. They were gone within the hour. They set up and within that hour they were gone. That's not what Detroit wants. I serve at the pleasure of the people, not some outside domestic terrorist, who wants to come into our city. What message is sent if you take over a police station and then I just abandon and say there's nothing I can do. Now tactically, things happen. We know that sometimes you might be in a situation where there may be a necessity to back off.
Black Lives Matter. Do you think they are a good or a bad group?
I'll tell you, black lives do matter, but I take it in that all lives matter because if black lives truly matter, then why are we not talking about black on black crime that happens to so many of our urban communities. We're not talking about the impact of managing daily protests and moving resources out of the communities. What about those lives? So in terms of messaging, I think initially that the movement, to bring light to police excessive force was proper. We don't disagree with their message. However, what's become of the Black Lives Matter movement cannot be and should not be about looting. It shouldn't be about violence against police officers. They say, well, violence works. I heard some well-known commentator who made the statement, well, America pays attention to violence, but I don't support violence. Why don't we digress and think back on the non-violent marches, Martin Luther King and the impact that had on change. So what's happened today, that under the guise of the banner of Black Lives Matter, the outside agitators call them anarchists, call them Boogaloo, Antifa, who have hijacked the message under their banner. They have no interest in Mr. Floyd. This is not about Mr. Floyd. Now, I got to believe there are some members, the original founders, who still believe in denouncing police excessive force or excessive force that results in the killing. We all agree with that.
So what have they gotten right and what have they gotten wrong?
Well, what they got wrong, I think that the chief issue, in my estimation, is allowing individuals who had other agendas to get involved. Instead of denouncing the violence and looting, what good are we doing if we go into urban communities and there's looting that's inspired by the agitators? What does that do in promoting black lives? I mean, what about black-owned businesses? What does that do to promote the agenda? It undermines it. It just clearly undermines the agenda. So I’ve got to believe that they can take that leadership role like our local activists have taken here and said, oh, no, you're not bringing this to Detroit. And some of those local activists were courageous who support Black Lives Matter in its original form, but said, you folks got to go, you've got to leave Detroit. You're not going to engage in violence. It's just that simple.
Your thoughts about Antifa?
On what I know about Antifa. Domestic terrorists. What I've heard about, and I'm not actively investigating Antifa or Boogalos, uh, whatever, I understand they're anti-government. Let's face it, law enforcement is the face of the government to domestic terrorists. If it is your agenda to undermine local, state, US government and you do it by force of violence, you are defined in my definition as a domestic terrorist. I don't care if you’re Antifa, Boogaloo or whatever.
President Trump has consistently mentioned Detroit and wants Detroit to thrive. Have you seen anything positive come out of his office for Detroit?
Well, I can tell you, he's been a staunch supporter of law enforcement across the nation. He said something recently I thought was kind of interesting. It was an interview and he was talking about Chicago and a few other cities. And then he got to Detroit, he said, but in Detroit and I hope I get the quote right. “He's a very, very good chief. They have a very, very good police chief,” and then probably within 24 hours, either before some point, Vice President Biden was being interviewed and Detroit came up, I guess similar conversations about what's going on in the different cities. And in that conversation, “Detroit has a good mayor, but they also have a good police chief.” So when I talk about these issues, I don't get caught on issues of the left or the right, but focus right down the middle and do what I have to do. That's what most Americans want, whether they are on the left or on the right.
Right now many police unions are endorsing President Trump, which is something that never really happened before. New York City PBA just endorsed President Trump. They've never, ever endorsed a president. Do you support President Trump?
I support the many things he has said regarding law enforcement. As I indicated earlier in this, I don't get into a partisan political conversation. I just don't.
Many in our profession are discussing the suicides we are having; now more than ever, people are having difficulties. We've actually now lost more to blue suicide than line-of-duty deaths. Please speak directly to the cop today who is in a dark place.
There is hope and here's what I know in my many years of service. The vast majority of the silent community that you serve, they love, they revere and support you. Never forget who you work for. Those are the people who have driven me for 44 years. Certainly it does help when you have a leader who will come out, stand up with you and support you. That does make a difference. There are many communities across this nation that support the men and women who serve. I am part of this law enforcement family. I love each and every one of you. I support you.
What does your playlist sound like when you're driving home? What do you listen to?
Now you’re getting a little personal. So admittedly, I workout every morning. You don't have a small waist like this at 64 years old if you don't workout. And when I workout, I listen to hip hop because I am a little older and I need to get my blood going.
So are you a Biggie or Tupac fan?
Well, you know, because I spent so much time in California, I got to lean a little bit to Tupac, but also because I grew up in Detroit and I think Biggie had an affinity to Detroit. He would talk about Detroit in a very affectionate way. So I kind of embrace them both. And they were both creative in their own right.
You know, Eminem put Detroit on the map.
Yes.
Are you an Eminem fan?
I like Eminem and guess what? Eminem was birthed by who? Artists out of Southern California where I spent the lion's share of my professional career. So, you know, do you like New York hip hop versus middle Midwest, like here in Detroit, Chicago, which has its own sound? Or do you like the West Coast? If it sounds good and I can get through a workout, it's good for me. It surprises everybody. Not my staff. They kind of know.
